Proposed Australian Open Declaration of Resistance : Part I

Let those who do not wish to sign anonymously, but those who are prepared to show themselves publically be allowed to also. Perhaps the usernames we use here at Cor Mariae could be used as signatures.
 
C

chrstnoel1

Guest
Admin said:
cojoman said:
The crux of the problem as we all know is a failure of the SSPX leadership ...ie of Frs Nelly, Fellay and Pfluger.
Much as I agree that we must do something, past 'petitions' and all strong letters of constructive criticism have fallen on deaf ears. There is also the issue of playing all one's cards by openly signing such a statement, as it gives the 'enemy' a neat list of 'troublemakers' as some of us are still in the good books and have some influence at Tynong.
Once our names are out there it may be difficult to contimue the good work currently being achieved.
We know it will fall on deaf ears cojoman. I understand that the ojective is to show solidarity with one another - particularly the priests who have shown us the way by openly declaring themselves and at great cost. There is no doubt we will be labelled as 'troublemakers' rather like Our Lord who did not shrink from declaring Himself. Being on the neoSSPX's good books only delays the inevitable...it will not put a dent in their set dead-course to become part of conciliar Rome. Tynong is their precious jewel - the seedbed of its seminarians.

We just go quietly going about our own work. If, in their paranoia the neo SSPX search out our names and react, so be it. It does not concern us nor disturb us. The more willingly and readily we pick up our Cross and carry it the more will God be moved to provide us with a permanent priest.

Link Link


I concur your sentiments Kath.




We in Asia do not have a permanent priest as Fr. Chazal is roaming the whole of Asia on his own. Among the resistance in Singapore, my family and I had been singled out as 'troublemakers' by the DS of Asia and the resident priests here But this does not stop us from standing our ground. We still attend Sunday Mass at the chapel and to date, no XSPX priests have refused us any Sacraments but of course, we do get that 'piercing' look! Funny though, I give them the same look and we end up smiling.




But again, the DS of Asia and his priests are different when they are in India, Korea, the Philippines, Malaysia. There they actually keep to their treats about the Sacraments, etc..!




As for burial, my wife and I have decided in the event any of us should pass on, the other would contact the Austrasia resistance priest for the Requiem Mass, to recite as many Rosary as possible and then to the cemetery for burial. no going to the XSPX chapel for Mass, etc...!

As and when the resistance priests comes around, together we will go to the cemetery and let Fr. do whatever that needs to be done at the gravesite.




I would think that the most important point is not, a church burial or if there is priest to administer the ceremony, etc..! but the state of the soul.

If the soul died in a state of grace, whether, there is a Mass or not, the soul is saved.

On the other hand, if the soul died in mortal sin, all the Masses and burial ceremony given to that soul, comes to naught.




So moral of this long winded story, be always in a state of grace, do your best and God will do the rest. As Holy Padre Pio favourite quote : Pray, Hope and don't worry.




PAX VOBIS








 

Admin

Administrator
catholicforever said:
Let those who do not wish to sign anonymously, but those who are prepared to show themselves publically be allowed to also. Perhaps the usernames we use here at Cor Mariae could be used as signatures.
This would defeat the whole purpose of the Declaration catholicforever because numerous names could be added anonymously making it completely worthless. Who could take a document that was signed anonymously seriously? It would show that we did not have the courage of our convictions and make us a laughing stock. It would be better to withold a signature altogether. Personally, I would never put my name down on a document that had anonynmous signatures.
 

Admin

Administrator
I received and adapted this update regarding the Declaration:

It is a good idea to keep things simple. Have already begun researching books and getting info together to help prepare for the Declaration. It would take a bit longer than expected to try and put everything together. Obviously, this Open Letter is not a document to be rushed.

Am also trying to gather together all the past Open Letters/Declarations from the past 12 months or so. Actually I saved them all into a folder on my computer, so that should be easy.

I will start to draft a layout and will share with you soon. M.



 

prayerwarrior

Active Member
This is not the email I sent to Fr Ortiz but the main points are repeated below:

It seems to me that whether we attend neo-SSPX masses for the Sacraments or whether we don't, we need to be sure that we KNOW our faith very well so that we are better equipped to maintain our faithful practises at home, and to discern clearly any errors, heresies and modernism/liberalism within ourselves (ouch) and elsewhere.
*Sr Lucy gave several clues as to what is contained in the 3rd Secret, one of them being: "...in Portugal, the dogma of the faith will be preserved, etc....", meaning, of course, that elsewhere it will not.
*And Canon Gregory Hesse reminds us that a heresy will certainly place a soul in grave danger (heretics go to hell, don't they?).
Bearing the above-mentioned in mind I made myself a short list of "must haves" for immediate study, and decided to share it on this website for those of you who may find it of interest. They are:
1. "The Foundations of Catholic Dogma", by Ludwig Ott
2. "The Canons and Decrees of the Council of Trent
3. "The Catechism of the Council of Trent"
4. The Denzinger
5. "The Popes Against Modern Errors" - containing 16 Papal Documents including the "Pascendi"
6. Dvd/video "Papal Infallibility" by Canon Hesse
7. "Brand New" - a brief historical account and explanation of the lead up to the the SSPX crisis.

I would be very interested if anyone has anything else they would recommend to add to my list.
 

prayerwarrior

Active Member
<div class="quote" timestamp="1390658542" source="/post/1808/thread" author="@nick"><div class="quote_body"><div class="quote_avatar_container"><div class="avatar-wrapper avatar_size_quote avatar-0">//images.proboards.com/v5/defaultavatar.png</div></div><div class="quote_header">Jan 25, 2014 14:02:22 GMT @nick said:</div>Has the first five on this list.<div class="quote_clear"></div></div></div> t9006Hi Nick, that's good. The other two are videos available on YouTube - just search: 'SSPX Brand New', and: 'Canon Hess Papal Infallibility', for the other. If you come across anything else please let me know.
 
P

partyonregardless

Guest
The importance of praying to the Holy Ghost for light and grace also, cannot be overlooked.
 
S

suzanne

Guest
cojoman said:
The crux of the problem as we all know is a failure of the SSPX leadership ...ie of Frs Nelly, Fellay and Pfluger.
Much as I agree that we must do something, past 'petitions' and all strong letters of constructive criticism have fallen on deaf ears. There is also the issue of playing all one's cards by openly signing such a statement, as it gives the 'enemy' a neat list of 'troublemakers' as some of us are still in the good books and have some influence at Tynong.
Once our names are out there it may be difficult to contimue the good work currently being achieved.
Hi Cojoman,

Just a personal question if I may? My brother Philippe (Borgonovo) is in Tynong, could you tell me which side he is taking? I haven't talked to him in a long time but don't want to stir things up with him, there has been enough stirring between us already...
Thanks in advance!
Viva Cristo Rey
Suzanne
 
S

suzanne

Guest
Personally, I have no problem with my name being made public...
Viva Cristo Rey
 

Admin

Administrator
<div class="quote" timestamp="1390875291" author="@suzanne" source="/post/1868/thread"><div class="quote_body"><div class="quote_avatar_container"><div class="avatar-wrapper avatar_size_quote avatar-0">//images.proboards.com/v5/defaultavatar.png</div></div><div class="quote_header">Jan 28, 2014 2:14:51 GMT @suzanne said:</div>Personally, I have no problem with my name being made public...
Viva Cristo Rey<div class="quote_clear"></div></div></div>

There would be no point in making the Declaration without our names on it. See above posts.
 
S

suzanne

Guest
Admin said:
<div class="quote" source="/post/1868/thread" author="@suzanne" timestamp="1390875291"><div class="quote_body"><div class="quote_avatar_container"><div class="avatar-wrapper avatar_size_quote avatar-0">//images.proboards.com/v5/defaultavatar.png</div></div><div class="quote_header">Jan 28, 2014 2:14:51 GMT @suzanne said:</div>Personally, I have no problem with my name being made public...
Viva Cristo Rey
There would be no point in making the Declaration without our names on it. See above posts.
<div class="quote_clear"></div></div></div>I agree! :)
 

prayerwarrior

Active Member
<div class="quote" author="@partyonregardless" source="/post/1866/thread" timestamp="1390873735"><div class="quote_body"><div class="quote_avatar_container"><div class="avatar-wrapper avatar_size_quote avatar-0">//images.proboards.com/v5/defaultavatar.png</div></div><div class="quote_header">Jan 28, 2014 1:48:55 GMT @partyonregardless said:</div>The importance of praying to the Holy Ghost for light and grace also, cannot be overlooked.<div class="quote_clear"></div></div></div>
Totally agree POR. Thanks.
 

Admin

Administrator
chrstnoel1 said:
Dear Admin,




Your proposition to the above is great.




However, it would be greater if the ODR is called 'Austrasia Open Declaration of Resistance'?? Hmmh! that would include us, in Asia, wouldn't it?




We are small throughout Asia, remnants of the remnants, as H.E. Bishop Williamson would say, but to quote an old Japanese proverb : * A single arrow is easily broken, but not ten in a bundle.*

Pardon me but just my humble opinion.




PAX VOBIS
Noel

A draft copy of the Declaration is being drawn up in time to show it to Father Ortiz who comes to our region this coming week-end.

Member chrstnoel's suggestion above has been most welcome and is being incorporated into the Declaration. It is hoped that as soon as the draft is approved by Father it will be published on Cor Mariae. Members who wish to add their names to the Declaration will be invited to do so. No user-or-anonymous-names will be added.
 

Admin

Administrator
Update: Member Marianne has completed her draft; Father Ortiz has seen it; it is now in the hands if a proficient resistor for editing.
 
M

mariaangelagrow

Guest
It seems to me that the Church started out sans amenities, gathering in secret, in danger of death. I believe we need to stand for the truth, regardless of consequences. True, I was never part of the neo-SSPX. However, when I first came back to the Church, I was rescuing with a pro-life rescue group called The Lambs of Christ. It was lead by Fr Norman Weslin, who had a vocation after the death of his spouse. Previously, he had been a military officer. Now I will say that Fr Weslin was courageous and cared greatly for the unborn. However, when we were in Harris Cty Jail, in Houston TX, several of us landed a judge who would not accept a "no lo contendere" plea. Unless we pleaded guilty, he would give a sentence based on the number of priors that we had. Sadly, I was in the position of being the problem in the case. I had the most priors in this country. I told Fr Weslin I would be happy to remain in jail alone, and would rejoin them when I was released. He did not like that idea, and insisted that I was under obedience and must plead guilty if he told me to do so. Being newly returned to the Church, I thought I had to do so. I did, but was very upset. After that a number of people left the Lambs. I learned from Joan Andrews Bell, another rescuer, that I did not have to obey something that was wrong. When Fr Weslin declared that pleading guilty was more efficient, would get us out quicker for more rescues, I had to leave the group. Many people who supported Fr. Weslin were angry with me. My situation did precipitate the situation in which many left, but it was Fr W who decided to force the taking of guilty pleas. These days many may not understand this issue. The law allows of breaking a lesser law if there is a necessity. Trespassing to save a drowning child would be an example. The courts do no allow the necessity defense in the case of the unborn because it does not consider them persons. By saying we were guilty, we were saying, no it was not necessary to save the life of the unborn, because we agree they are not persons. I could not do that again, and was sorry I had done it even under duress. I lost friends and was blamed by many Catholics. But one always has to stand for the truth, or everything else in one's life is meaningless. Start by denying one thing, or allowing small deviations, and it will not take much to become a heretic or apostate. Compromise on your own comforts, etc., but never on the truth. Jesus Himself is Truth, and whenever we turn our backs on the truth, we in some small measure, are turning our backs on Him. I hope I do not seem too harsh, but at 60, I have learned that "merciful" half-truths are pernicious and destructive and not at all merciful.
 

Admin

Administrator
One of the sufferings of human nature, surely, is our inability to undo the wrongs we have done. It takes a lot of courage to admit them and repent of them. How loving and merciful is our Father in heaven who, through His Divine Son, has taken on our sins and given us the wonderful Sacrament of Confession. You are not alone Maria - we are all sinners, who, without His Mercy would never be saved, forgiven thereby enabled by His Grace to get back on our feet and carry our crosses. Remember me in your prayers. Kath
 
M

mariaangelagrow

Guest
Thank you for your encouraging words. Of course you are in my prayers. All of you are. If it were not for Frs. Pfeiffer and Hewko being here, I could wish to be there with so many wonderful people.
 
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